Until about an hour ago, I was a member. What prompted my withdrawal? Well, I was all but asked to leave.
It all started on Ms. Yaxley's blog post which asked "Why call yourself a Quaker?" At some point in the comments discussion, Martin Kelley, who seems to be the primary administrator of QuakerQuaker, and who does his own independent blogging at QuanterRanter, made the following comment: "At some point I should put out that none of you are the primary target audience of QuakerQuaker."
Somewhat taken aback, another commenter and I asked what he meant by that. It turns out that Martin is "concerned that QQ's demographic profile isn't right for outreach (it's skewing way old) and that most of the active users of the interactive features are long-time Friends hashing out inter-Quaker issues that in some cases might turn off the very people I'd like to appeal to."
Fair enough.
I then asked (and pardon the lack of exact language, deleting my account deleted my comments, too) whether he didn't want us there at all, to which he ultimately replied:
Hi all: I'm not commenting here anymore. This whole conversation has gotten incredibly annoying, academic and confrontational. The breath of fresh air with the blogging subculture is that we weren't having these kind of internet battles, fighting over words and definitions and getting all mock-offended about everything. I have no interest in facilitating this kind of polarizing debate.
QuakerQuaker is an outreach effort, which by definition means I'm most interested in people who are not already Quaker. I think I've been clear about the focus: primitive Christianity revived: looking positively at the Friends tradition (yes, which is Christian) and looking positively at the fresh winds in mainstream Christianity. If this isn't your bag, that's fine, I love you, you can come visit any time but please hold back on commenting five times per post. I'm asking for self-control here. I'm asking that everyone sit back and spend a moment in discernment whether their comment is really helpful or whether it's merely trying to score zingers against someone you disagree with.
What did I take away from this, other than sincere doubts that Martin truly "love[s]" me? Here are a few things:
(1) I'm confused about who was being confrontational with whom? Why was it necessary to tell us that "none" of us were the target audience.
First, that type of language strikes me as purposefully exclusionary. What goal was he trying to achieve? I don't know.
Second, what audience does he think he is going to attract on such a network? Does he sincerely think that "people who are not already Quaker" are going to find this site appealing or welcoming? How many such members does he have, I wonder?
I'm not the only one confused about this. Ask the many Quakers who are members now. One of Martin's friends on QuakerQuaker named Chad, described QuakerQuaker on his blog this way:
(2) Martin seems oddly touchy about the suggestion that Quakers can be anything but Christian. Putting aside that many people consider themselves Quakers who don't necessarily consider themselves Christian, one gets the feeling that it's not the old-versus-new Quakers that are really bothering Martin, it's the non-Christian Quakers that are bothering him.
It seems that more than Quaker, Martin considers himself an "Emergent Christian" (here's a link to a Wikipedic explanation he suggested to us; hopefully you'll have more luck understanding it than I did). So there it is. I read in Martin's comments, here and elsewhere, a general frustration over Quakers who don't align themselves with Christianity. While acknowledging that Quakerism is not monolithic, he seems to wish that all Quakers could at least agree on Christianity (or else shut up).
(3) Most surprising is this: As a 29-year-0ld Christian who only has been attending Quaker meetings for less than two years now, you would think that I was exactly the type of person Martin would want on QuakerQuaker. Alas, I guess not.
Is this outreach?
Having participated extensively in the discussion being questioned, and having participated in several other discussions which included non-Christian Quakers, I can state categorically that it is not non-Christian Quakers that make Martin uncomfortable, but Quakers who are actively hostile to Christian expression. One quote from the discussion should illustrate: "As for my being used to and seeming to expect a dogmatic, exclusive, doctrine-driven Christianity, that is only because Christianity is still dogmatic, exclusive, and doctrine-driven, no matter what kind of "emergent face" church leaders try to put on it, as I mentioned further back in the thread." Martin does not have as much patience with confrontational posts as I have.
ReplyDeleteWell, Nate, maybe I'm wrong, then. Thank you for your comment.
ReplyDeleteI will say, I felt like his comments were more targeted at me than "Mystery Hidden in Light." I am very certainly not anti-Christian.
I have trouble with Martn's style. I took offense (which he described as being "mock-offended") to his completely gratuitous comment that NONE of us are the targets of QuakerQuaker in the first place. I interpreted this as "go away" and so I did. I don't need to be cyber-lectured to.
His tone leaves something to be desired. For example, he started his response to Ms. Yaxley's post in the first place with "Huh?" Who starts a post with "Huh?"? "Huh?" means "How could you be so stupid as to think what you thought?" That kind of tone is, quite frankly, unacceptable.
His posts are frequently combative, know-it-all-ish, judgmental, and condescending. If this were my first and only encounter with a Quaker, I'm not sure I'd ever go back.
"I have trouble with Martn's style" I'll buy that. So do I, and with Alice's and with... well, a few more.... and I have deleted more than one of my own posts after mature reflection, and maybe should have deleted more. I guess my point is that love "is not quick to take offense" and that ain't always easy. I think the Quaker practice of sitting with a ministry before replying is sometimes the equivalent of counting to ten... and then counting again. Hopefully we are all trying to work out these differences, trying to at least understand where the other is coming from because we really believe that we are all trying to follow the Light, but almost all of us are human too.
ReplyDeleteThanks, Nate. I appreciate your comments. And thanks for this: "almost all of us are human too." That's great!
ReplyDelete